Nancy Pelosi’s impact record is undeniable. With more than three decades in Congress, the San Francisco juggernaut is frequently cited as one of the most powerful lawmakers of his generation — the man who racked up votes for the Affordable Care Act, who twice rose to the House speaker’s seat, and who built a fundraising machine that changed the way his party competes.
Last week, at the SXSW conference in Austin, Texas, I spoke with Pelosi about the record. In front of a crowd of creatives packed into the Vox Media Podcast Forum, I asked Pelosi about milestones in her career, her unwavering faith in the American electorate, and the prospect of November’s midterm elections.
Pelosi is preparing to leave Congress at the end of this term, and it comes at a time of uncertainty for the Democratic Party. Republicans control the White House. His party’s favorability in the polls has hit historic lows, and the once-liberal majority appears to be shifting by age, race and class. There is no consensus about what went wrong or who should lead next.
Regardless, Pelosi told me she has every confidence that Democrats will take back the House this year. And it’s hard to argue with a vote counter like this. The following is part of our conversation, edited for length and clarity. There’s more throughout the episode, so tune in Today, It’s Explained wherever you find podcasts, incl Apple Podcasts, Pandoraand Spotify.
You have been called the best orator in history. I wanted to know, what skill or trait do you think made you so successful?
The thing about that is that when you’re a member of parliament, you have, let’s say, a powerful person at work. You have hearings, you have public opinion, you do all those things, and so you have time to make a decision. When you are speaker or governor or mayor or whatever – an executive position – then you have to act.
The reason you act is because if you don’t act right away, people think, “Oh, he’s going to think about it. And while he’s thinking, we’re going to remove this option or that option.” You just have to take action. Then you get credit that it will work, and that’s it.
It’s (also) very important when you go out to do these things just to make sure people trust your judgment – that you know what you’re talking about, you know how to do something. And I have to give credit to the members who are brave enough to vote for power, which will be abused by the other side no matter what they do.
Another thing is that nothing good happens unless you have motivation from outside. Internal drive, external motivation. And that’s like what President Lincoln said, “Public sentiment is everything. With it you can accomplish almost anything, without it nothing.” But for public sentiment to prevail, people must know, you must go out and share public sentiment.
YOur story is built on faith in the American people and it seems like that’s kind of the foundation. I wanted to kind of gut-check that. You are scheduled to retire in 2016 and 2024, and Americans elected a president who surprised you and many others and forced you back into office.
There have been hard times. I’m thinking A terrible attack on your husband in 2022 or things like that January 6 riot where you were in the building. How do you maintain this kind of hope in the American electorate when it doesn’t always seem to be returned to you? I want to ask about your faith in Americans.
Our founders were such scholars. They were amazing in what they put together, a land that was more amazing than anything anyone had ever seen. They believed in the goodness of the American people. And that is what gives me hope. I believe in the inherent goodness of the American people. If they know, in the public sense, if they know what all this means to them, they will make the right judgment.
There is plenty of evidence of Donald Trump’s backsliding as we speak, but that doesn’t mean that people would prefer the Democrats as an alternative. How confident are you that the Democrats will take back the House and possibly the Senate in November?
Not only will we win, we will win big.
To win an election, you have to mobilize. You must own the land because we know: The American people are good. We know that what we want to do is in their interest. They know what their interests are. We respect that.
And by the way, our entire democracy is at risk. Free and fair elections, independent courts, due process, rule of law, separation of powers. We are not kings, we are a democracy. But we save democracy at the kitchen table. So what we’re talking about in terms of cost reduction, affordability of course, but in people’s terms, reducing the cost of health care and groceries and education and whatever, that’s what they’re telling us they vote for more. (We need) messages, awareness, and money to do it.
I think right now there is a big question about trust in institutions, trust in elected officials. Considering how much Congress has seemed to retreat from its own mandateWhat do you think the importance of this midterm is? If you’re someone who’s skeptical and says, “Okay, the Democrats are going to win Congress, but Donald Trump is going to do whatever he wants to do.” What is Speaker Pelosi’s response to that?
Well, let me just say, first of all, that Congress has not gone backwards. The Republicans in Congress have withdrawn – they have dissolved the House of Representatives. They have given the president power for nothing.
The Senate to some extent as well, but they have slightly different rules. In the Constitution, the House of Representatives has been given enormous powers. The Parliament is the First Article of the Constitution, but even within that, the Parliament has the power to declare war, such matters which are fundamental to the Constitution. They have given up.
If the Democrats take back the White House, the last time you all had Congress under the presidency of Donald Trump, there were the two charges. Is that something you think, if the Democrats take back the house this November, we should expect?
The only person responsible for the impeachment of Donald Trump – not once but twice – is Donald Trump. He didn’t give us a choice. So I don’t think you go out and start by saying, “We’re going to sue them.” Winning is about people. It’s not about him. It’s about people, meeting their kitchen table needs so they have faith. And we have to restore that. And the best way to do that is to listen to people.
You have said that Donald Trump is an “evil creature.”,” but you said those are empty words for what you really wanted to say. This is the South and South-West, I would let you finish with these details. Want to tell us how you really feel?
If you are the president of the United States, you have a certain responsibility to live up to the vision of our founders. The beauty of the Constitution, the sublime beauty of the Constitution, is the separation of powers. They did not want a king; they did everything in the Constitution to make sure we don’t have it. So he has broken all that.
In terms of one of my biggest issues coming to Congress – saving the world – forget about it. (He has) his hand in the pocket of the oil industry. And so we take many steps away from clean air, clean water.
Be thankful for the sacrifices of our men and women in uniform who have fought for our freedom and other freedoms in the world and not call them losers. When you are at the grave of a dead soldier, respect that.
And then, of course, the expectations of our children. Forget about it, as far as he is concerned.
But I didn’t come here to talk about it. He is what he is. We will win in November. You will see a big change in how the separation of powers works. It’s about honoring the vision of our founders. It’s about ending corruption in this government, and that’s what I think of him.
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