In the past few years, there has been a major shift in government propaganda coming out of North Korea. A young girl – maybe 13 or so – has been a participant in the main events of the state. Before launching an intercontinental ballistic missile, he can be seen side by side with him father, North Korean leader Kim Jong Uninspecting the missile. In some major countries military parades or for gatherings of world leaders, he receives greetings and bows from North Korean generals and government officials.
The girl’s name is believed to be Kim Ju Ae. The world learned about his existence thanks to the five-time NBA champion Dennis Rodman, who was introduced to him during a visit to North Korea more than ten years ago.
Before Kim Ju Ae, the inner workings of North Korea’s ruling family were mostly hidden. In fact, before Kim Jong Un was chosen to succeed his father, he was almost completely hidden from the public eye. Hence this sudden attention to his daughter, paired with years old rumors about Kim Jong Un’s healthsparked considerable debate among North Korea’s intelligence and security communities. Is Kim Jong Un a proud father showing off his beloved son? Or is he doing something bigger – like taking care of a girl to eventually take over the role of supreme leader of a country of 26 million people?
It’s a big question. And it will be a big cultural change for the nationalist society of North Korea, which is old school, where it is very difficult to lead women. To help explain some of what goes on in the “hermit kingdom,” the Today, It’s Explained podcast spoke to freelance journalist and author Anna Fifield.
Fifield is the former Beijing and Tokyo bureau chief for the Washington Post. He has also written one of the definitive books on Kim Jong Un’s rise to power – The Great Heir: The Perfect Divine Destiny of Great Comrade Kim Jong Un. He is talking to Today, It’s Explained co-host Noel King unravels the black hole of espionage surrounding Pyongyang, how Jong Un may be trying to rewrite the laws of succession, and whether North Korea’s elite would ever rally behind a girl.
The following is part of their conversation, edited for length and clarity. There’s a lot more in the full podcast, so take a listen Today, It’s Explained wherever you find podcasts, incl Apple Podcasts, Pandoraand Spotify.
Anna, there is a girl we have seen in the picture with Kim Jong Un. This girl is his daughter. What do we know about him and why is his presence at his side so important?
There’s a lot we don’t know about her, but what we think we do know is that her name is Kim Ju Ae and that she’s about 13 years old, and we have a very unusual source for this information, which is Dennis Rodman.
When Kim Jong Un was at the beginning of his reign, there were efforts by some Americans to reach him and see if they could get in touch, to know more about this young man. And everyone knew that Kim Jong Un loved the Chicago Bulls. So first of all, a request was made to Michael Jordan. He had no intention of going to North Korea for some reason. But Dennis Rodman was ready to go to North Korea. And that started this incredible period of basketball diplomacy when the top US envoy to North Korea was a washed-up basketball star. And when the basketball player went to North Korea about 12 years ago and met Kim Jong Un, he grabbed this kid. And so she was told at that time that the child was 1 year old and her name was Kim Ju Ae.
The North Koreans have never mentioned him in state media or anywhere, so that’s the name we’re going with until they tell us otherwise. But the reason she’s garnered so much attention over the past few years is that she’s appeared on her father’s side frequently, and in unusual circumstances. He has been going on intercontinental ballistic missiles. He has been going out with his father regularly, often wearing similar clothing like the leather bomber jacket he wore when they drove the tank together. A very unusual father-daughter outing for a 13-year-old.
“It’s not unusual to take your 11-year-old to a rocket launch.”
This, of course, has sparked a lot of speculation that he is his heir apparent and that he wants to take over the family business, which runs a totalitarian state.
Kim Jong Un succeeded his father, and you and others have documented how he was hidden before being announced as the next leader of North Korea. Why do you think Kim Jong Un is seen in public with his own child, given that the way he grew up is different?
Kim Jong Un is the third generation leader of North Korea. They’ve only transitioned twice before, so there’s no set way to do this. But with his father Kim Jong Un, he spent 20, 30 years being promoted through the ranks and appearing in public as an adult to get this sense of legitimacy, the idea that he is the next leader of North Korea.
For Kim Jong Un, it was too fast. His father suffered a stroke in 2008 and died at the end of 2011. Kim Jong Un was introduced to the public in 2009, and then he had this very rapid period where he was promoted very quickly through the ranks, made a general, given a political office in the Workers’ Party of Korea, the ruling party. It looked hairy for a while there – it wasn’t clear that he could get the support of these octogenarian apparatchiks who had been there for decades, running the system.
I can only guess from this now that Kim Jong Un wants to make sure that his successor does not go through the same very fast, complicated process. Kim Jong Un is still in his mid-40s; He doesn’t look healthy, but it’s unlikely he’s about to hand over the reins anytime soon. But I think he is probably laying the foundation in 30 or 40 years for his daughter to take that position because it will be very difficult for this communist monarchy to move to the fourth generation, but even more so for a woman to take a position in a society that has an extreme patriarchy.
When did his appearance begin? When did people start saying, it seems this man wants his daughter to take power?
It was almost three years ago that Kim Ju Ae first appeared in public. And at first there was a lot of doubt or talk about what he was doing there, why he was taking him out of all these missile blasts. And I think that’s because it’s not very common to take your 11-year-old to a rocket launch. But also because it seemed beyond the pale that he would try to promote a little girl as the leader of North Korea.
But as she grows more visible in the public eye – she is called a beloved daughter in government propaganda in North Korea – it has become increasingly likely that she is being groomed and groomed by the one percent in Pyongyang who are keeping her in power with the idea that she will one day take over.
It has gone from the seemingly inevitable possibility that he will try, at least, to take her.
Does he have other children?
Again, another thing we don’t know.
I mean, the South Korean intelligence service didn’t even know how to pronounce Kim Jong Un’s name until the North Koreans revealed it in government propaganda. There is no human intelligence on North Korea, so there is a lot we don’t know.
These pictures, I think, because most of them coming from North Korea are pre-approved. I think these pictures are somehow sent through the state media, which means, uh, they have some control over how this girl is treated. What do the images tell us about the story the government wants to tell?
It is very surprising. She looks a lot like her mother. His mother, Ri Sol Ju, was a very popular singer in North Korea and a household name, so everyone could recognize him. And his mother played an unusual role in North Korea as well.
She was there as the Kate Middleton of North Korea. She is there to modernize and show the friendly face of this monarchy and that daughter Kim Ju Ae continues that in many ways, because she looks so much like her mother. She wears her hair the same way, often wearing these cute little skirt suits.
I think the idea they’re conveying here, between his father’s leather bomber jackets and his mother’s elegant looks, is that he’s the next generation of modern North Korea.
Given that North Korea is a patriarchal society and that sexism is everywhere in the world, and that this girl is so young, how sure are you that if something happens to Kim Jong Un, the North Korean military and elite will help this child?
It depends on when it will happen. I must say, I didn’t think Kim Jong Un could do that. I did not think that the old guard would accept this 20-year-old man who was healthy to play basketball in Switzerland and he had no political or military experience to be the next leader of the administration. But through his extremely brutal regime and his habit of executing his bullies, Kim Jong Un has been able to do just that.
So I’ll never say never, in terms of whether Kim Ju Ae can take over, but I think it’s very difficult, in large part, because this administration is changing so much.
It may have collapsed decades ago with the death of the Soviet Union and the death of its founder, but somehow it has managed to survive through this combination of corruption, kleptocracy and fear to keep ordinary people – including the old guard who run the country – living in constant fear of being purged or worse.
It is unlikely that the daughter could do anything to take the chance. But I, again, have my doubts. In a patriarchal, very Confucian society that values masculinity and age, it seems like a step too far.
